I don’t think you’re trying to engage honestly but I’m going to on the off chance someone is reading this thread on a bad day and thinking “maybe he has a point? Why can’t I be attracted to XYZ?”
You’re trying to twist this into a question of “do I have to be attracted to everyone in order to be accepting”?
The original question that’s being engaged with is why, in your words, does
“morbidly obese”
“gender non-conforming”
Make for “the worst character designs in living memory”? Why can’t gender non-conforming characters have an interesting character design? Why is physical fitness required for an interesting character design?
The subtext I’m reading from this is you think that in order for a character to have an interesting design that they must be attractive. If that’s not what you’re trying to say feel free to claim otherwise, but I don’t know why else you’d bring those factors in if you weren’t…
A counter argument to your claim: I claim deep rock galactic has very interesting character designs. The costumes all have a similar theme but are distinct enough I can tell the difference between the characters. The colors are both grimy to indicate being underground for long periods of time but also each has a bright color palette so you can easily distinguish between characters. I think these designs are great.
I am not attracted to any of these characters. I would never want to fuck any of them. I still think their designs are great. I don’t think attractiveness is a requirement for interesting character design.
I get your point about sexual attraction not being necessary, but you’re still kind of making the other user’s point for them. Deep Rock Galactic works because of a cohesive aesthetic with characters that actually fit the world they’re in. Concord was like a cast of soulless GI Joe toybait characters who went through a corporate intersectional diversity blender.
I mean I wasn’t really arguing that Concord had good character designs. Just that a chunk of his criteria (obesity and gender conformity) aren’t good criteria of it.
There’s something deeply funny to me that the same political side that demands representation for everyone in everything is then stunned to know that if EVERY character doesn’t represent something the typical audience likes/wants to see that audience will go elsewhere.
This is not rocket science, and it’s such a deeply american problem it’s honestly hilarious and frustrating at the same time with your culture’s obsession with moralizing media consumption and production only somehow ever registering one way.
If your game’s characters look lame, uninteresting, and nothing like most people would want to be, nobody’s gonna buy it. It’s that simple.
Progressives keep banging on about how people need to be represented to want to partake in a piece of media,* then when a piece of media that represents exclusively stereotypical members of a portland polycule shows up people are surprised if it’s played exclusively by some polyamorous portlanders (not even all of them if you look at the stats).
* which is yet more horseshit america-centrism, the rest of the world is used to not being represented in most media we see since americans make most of it, and i’d rather laminate my own testicles than subject myself at an earnest attempt from an american at representing my demo.
Furthermore:
Overwatch is super diverse, but all their characters (yes, even the fucking gorilla, Winston is handsome as fuck and he passes the harkness test) look appealing.
Their bodies look well proportioned, even Roadhog who is a morbidly obese alcoholic with visible cirrhosis looks more visually appealing than any concord character, because even he looks like an idealised and larger than life (pun very intended) version of a morbidly obese alcoholic.
Meanwhile concord characters look like frumpy cosplayers that wouldn’t qualify for 3rd place at a backwater anime con somewhere in whatever US state has the worst inbreeding rates.
Your example with DRG is very fitting as well because I don’t think most people would call those characters sexually attractive (but trust me, some absolutely do), but they are extremely visually appealing. Bold recognizable shapes that fit their roles, good color combinations, fun presentations.
Concord looks like it’s about to scold you for microaggressing someone, DRG looks like it’s about to attempt to burp another country’s national anthem it hasn’t even heard before.
DRG oozes goliardic fun, while Concord looks and feels like the used dishrag at the bar where that team’s art director will end up working if there is any justice in the world.
In games like these, there’s absolutely room for minority or less “appealing” character design. Give them interesting abilities that match their character design and they’ll see play. But you should also have some conventionally “appealing” characters because it turns out people like to role play as someone more attractive than they see themselves IRL.
Provide a good mix so people can role play however they want, and keep things balanced such that some of the minority characters see play by the min/maxers.
I don’t think you’re trying to engage honestly but I’m going to on the off chance someone is reading this thread on a bad day and thinking “maybe he has a point? Why can’t I be attracted to XYZ?”
You’re trying to twist this into a question of “do I have to be attracted to everyone in order to be accepting”?
The original question that’s being engaged with is why, in your words, does
Make for “the worst character designs in living memory”? Why can’t gender non-conforming characters have an interesting character design? Why is physical fitness required for an interesting character design?
The subtext I’m reading from this is you think that in order for a character to have an interesting design that they must be attractive. If that’s not what you’re trying to say feel free to claim otherwise, but I don’t know why else you’d bring those factors in if you weren’t…
A counter argument to your claim: I claim deep rock galactic has very interesting character designs. The costumes all have a similar theme but are distinct enough I can tell the difference between the characters. The colors are both grimy to indicate being underground for long periods of time but also each has a bright color palette so you can easily distinguish between characters. I think these designs are great.
I am not attracted to any of these characters. I would never want to fuck any of them. I still think their designs are great. I don’t think attractiveness is a requirement for interesting character design.
You wouldn’t fuck Scout? Prude.
I get your point about sexual attraction not being necessary, but you’re still kind of making the other user’s point for them. Deep Rock Galactic works because of a cohesive aesthetic with characters that actually fit the world they’re in. Concord was like a cast of soulless GI Joe toybait characters who went through a corporate intersectional diversity blender.
I mean I wasn’t really arguing that Concord had good character designs. Just that a chunk of his criteria (obesity and gender conformity) aren’t good criteria of it.
There’s something deeply funny to me that the same political side that demands representation for everyone in everything is then stunned to know that if EVERY character doesn’t represent something the typical audience likes/wants to see that audience will go elsewhere.
This is not rocket science, and it’s such a deeply american problem it’s honestly hilarious and frustrating at the same time with your culture’s obsession with moralizing media consumption and production only somehow ever registering one way.
If your game’s characters look lame, uninteresting, and nothing like most people would want to be, nobody’s gonna buy it. It’s that simple.
Progressives keep banging on about how people need to be represented to want to partake in a piece of media,* then when a piece of media that represents exclusively stereotypical members of a portland polycule shows up people are surprised if it’s played exclusively by some polyamorous portlanders (not even all of them if you look at the stats).
* which is yet more horseshit america-centrism, the rest of the world is used to not being represented in most media we see since americans make most of it, and i’d rather laminate my own testicles than subject myself at an earnest attempt from an american at representing my demo.
Furthermore:
Overwatch is super diverse, but all their characters (yes, even the fucking gorilla, Winston is handsome as fuck and he passes the harkness test) look appealing.
Their bodies look well proportioned, even Roadhog who is a morbidly obese alcoholic with visible cirrhosis looks more visually appealing than any concord character, because even he looks like an idealised and larger than life (pun very intended) version of a morbidly obese alcoholic.
Meanwhile concord characters look like frumpy cosplayers that wouldn’t qualify for 3rd place at a backwater anime con somewhere in whatever US state has the worst inbreeding rates.
Your example with DRG is very fitting as well because I don’t think most people would call those characters sexually attractive (but trust me, some absolutely do), but they are extremely visually appealing. Bold recognizable shapes that fit their roles, good color combinations, fun presentations.
Concord looks like it’s about to scold you for microaggressing someone, DRG looks like it’s about to attempt to burp another country’s national anthem it hasn’t even heard before.
DRG oozes goliardic fun, while Concord looks and feels like the used dishrag at the bar where that team’s art director will end up working if there is any justice in the world.
ETA: two words, punctuation
Exactly!
In games like these, there’s absolutely room for minority or less “appealing” character design. Give them interesting abilities that match their character design and they’ll see play. But you should also have some conventionally “appealing” characters because it turns out people like to role play as someone more attractive than they see themselves IRL.
Provide a good mix so people can role play however they want, and keep things balanced such that some of the minority characters see play by the min/maxers.